WeThePeopleFoundation.org caught in OCD lie careless error.

I’m the first to say that an anti-Obama organization telling a lie bearing false information is hardly news; it’s more the rule than the exception, but this one is so blatant and so easily blown that it really MUST be shown up.

The home page [since changed after the error was pointed by a commenter here] has this blown up image of block 7c from a 1963 Hawaiian Birth Certificate captioned: “County and State or Foreign Country” [emphasis mine]” and next to it they say: “Note that the birth “Certificate” provides a field where one can register a “FOREIGN” birth in Hawaii”.

The Hawaiian Certificate of Live birth is too blurry to read on the home page, but the larger version here is clear enough: blocks 7a-g are the “Usual residence of the mother”, not the Place of Birth. The Place of birth is in block 6a, whose caption says: “City, town or rural location”. There’s nothing about a foreign country.

They showed the mother’s residence block as “proof” that the place of birth could be foreign. Of course foreign-born births couldn’t be registered in Hawaii until 1982, 21 years after Barack Obama’s own birth was registered but truth or accuracy doesn’t seem to be the intent of WeThePeopleFoundation.

Just in case We the “lying” “error prone” People Foundation changes their home page, I captured the original, and it’s available here. An old style Hawaiian birth certificate is here.

[I have now determined that this fake issue goes back the Alan Keyes lawsuit in California. WeThePeopleFoundation.org probably copied it from somewhere else.]

About Kevin

Just an old guy with opinions that I like to bounce off other people.
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34 Responses to WeThePeopleFoundation.org caught in OCD lie careless error.

  1. MoniQue says:

    You said “Does anyone doubt that what this is saying: the caption of block 7c PROVES that foreign-born children could be registered in Hawaii in 1963 (the year of the certificate)?”

    I not only doubt it, I say that is an incorrect conclusion because block 7c does NOT “prove” that foreign-born children could be registered in Hawaii in 1963. All block 7c is states is where the MOTHER’s usual residence is, i.e, the MOTHER’S usual residence. Her usual residence could be in another country, it is for the MOTHER, not the child. The mother could usually reside in France or Italia and had a baby in Hawaii, and the baby would be a natural born US citizen. Furthermore, “Reside” doesn’t even mean where the mother or father was even born, it simply means where they live, or the most common or usual place they live.

    But all of that is a mute point, because block 7c is basically a mailing address and has nothing to do with where the mother was born AND FOR SURE NOTHING TO DO WITH THE BABY OR WHERE THE BABY WAS BORN.

  2. Kevin says:

    Hi. I think you misunderstood. I meant to ask is there any doubt that WeThePeopleFoundation was claiming proof, not that I did. I am saying just the opposite. I will reword to remove the confusion. Thanks for your comment. I REALLY do not want this article misunderstood.

  3. MoniQue says:

    Right on Kevin. Yes I misunderstood. ThanX

  4. MoniQue says:

    Do you want to update it for the comment on CountUsOut? If so please do and we can adjust.

  5. TRUTH says:

    You probably have a point, I’ve not even taken time to look at it because it is irrelevant to the truth of all of this. So some idiot(s) post a lie, what purpose will that serve even THEM? Assuming for 1 minute 100% of the people that read it believe it, it still isn’t admissible. I could tell you all kinds of lies, which would be stupid of me because it gets me no where. Maybe the webmaster of that site is a jerk and posted the lie, with no common sense people approving it. Who really cares, again it means nothing.

    I believe facts, one important one is in a vault unseen by anyone creditable. Another is the Constitution, which the Justices will be making their interpretation of real soon.

    Of note, see how quick you are to find errors/lies when you go after something? But when defending it, oh no that is another story. Human nature I guess.

  6. Kevin says:

    Truth, you’re the person who (in another comment) suggested I read stuff on WeThePeopleFoundation.org. It was your recommendation that sent me there.

    When I saw that page on WeThePeopleFoundation.org I was fooled initially. I though maybe I had made a mistake and there was an earlier Hawaiian law that I had not found and that no one had cited. I went into the inquiry not knowing how it would come out. Which ever way it came out, I would have posted the result here, either castigating the web site for lying or myself for not being rigorous in my study.

    My personal view is that all the Obama Citizenship Denial suits are so flaky in their legal arguments that there is no judge who will take any seriously enough to actually let a case go to trial. I expect Donofrio will get his third and final “no” tomorrow.

  7. TRUTH says:

    Ok I should have read that first to prevent making two posts, my bad.

    That isn’t a Lie Kevin. That is a IDIOT that can’t Read very Well. They would be more convincing saying he has a Orange COLB and it has to be Green.

    I’ll write them myself if I can find a direct email asking who posted that “piece of work”. <–like the ref?

  8. Kevin says:

    I have to agree that in this case one cannot say positively whether there is an intentional deception or incompetence. I have tried to expose this mistake as publicly as I can, so I assume the longer it stays up, the more likely that it is an intentional lie. There is a third possibility and that’s indifference. WeThePeopleFoundation.org might have found that somewhere else and never cared to look closely at it before making it the centerpiece of their web site.

    In talking with a friend of mine we arrived an at impasse over whether Phillip Berg lied intentionally about things he said, or whether he is just a very bad lawyer. I have to think that Jerome Corsi (Obama Nation) with a PhD from Harvard can’t hide behind the excuse of stupidity for the long list of lies in his book, although I suppose he might claim indifference. Indeed one review described it as a “paste up job”, an publishing term meaning a bunch of reports put together without checking them.

  9. TRUTH says:

    Look, last thing I intend to do is attack you, but just what does “tried to make this mistake at publicly as I can” really define, talking about it in here and other blogs negatively? You USE the word “mistake”, so how about instead of publicly calling them liars, Contact them directly, tell them they made a grave mistake, then if they leave it up you would have better grounds of the accusation.

    I did contact them and told them they either have made a big mistake, explaining why, or there is a point I was missing, and to please reply to me that they received my email and understood it. Like I said in another entry, what would they stand to gain telling a lie knowing it would never go anywhere? It was stupidity in my opinion, one I would like to see them publicly admit too.

  10. Kevin says:

    I didn’t find a way to contact them on the WeThePeopleFoundation.org web site. I’m glad you did. If the page comes down, then it was an error. If the page stays up, it is a lie. As of 6:44 PM EST on December 7, 2008 it is still up.

    I posted a claim that the site was a lie on a number of anti-Obama blogs and one newspaper site where a lot of anti-Obama material appears. I believe this to be true. If this had been a back-page item on the site, I might have believed it was mistake, but not as the centerpiece of their whole web site.

  11. Kevin says:

    It’s 11:48 AM on December 8. The WeThePeopleFoundation.org web site hasn’t remove their false information about Hawaii birth certificates yet.

    I was VERY PLEASED to see that just now a Google search for WeThePeopleFoundation.org turned up ON THE FIRST PAGE this article from BlogOrDie! Getting a page one hit from Google is a big deal.

  12. Truth says:

    DANG!! that it is. Kinda kewl.

  13. Truth says:

    Of course now I think about it, I’m not surprised. Not sure if your aware of this, but Google is on the Obama wagon with you. I honestly can’t recall what it was they did, but they were somehow involved in shutting down or interfering with a few conservative websites. One of their busy browsers has came across your site and made it high priority due to the Favorable Subject Titles you’ve used.

    I hope my biased opinions don’t interfere with your being posted. Then again, I am one of the wordiest contributors here, so I’ll pat myself on the back for aiding in your quest. haha.

    Still, Congrats.

  14. Kevin says:

    Having run through about 30 pages of Google results last night on Obama stuff, I can say that almost all of it was negative. I know that Google will refuse to index certain abusive web sites, sites designed to trick the search engine in some way. One example is adding a zillion keywords to the site which are not visible in the browser (white text on white, or tiny font). In fact, I haven’t found a way yet with Google to find pro-Obama, or even balanced web sites.

    Another reason I get good results with Google is that the blog software I use accesses a server that notifies Google when I change content. I can enter stuff and find it on Google a few minutes later. Google also likes content that is frequently updated.

    In the conspiracy theory world, the “Fix is In” everywhere, the Congress, Universities, the Supreme Court, TV, Radio, Newspapers and now even Google. How else can one explain their cause being marginalized?

    5:41 PM. False Obama item still on WeThePeopleFoundation.org home page.

  15. TRUTH says:

    OH, your disputing me saying Google is on the BHO Wagon, I see. I had to read that twice to pick up the cynicism.

    OK, I retract I Said such a Terrible THING about Google. There are THOUSANDs of workers at Google, probably reasonable Conservatives alongside the People of Change(Hail to the Messiah). They own a lot more than just the Google Browser and I don’t doubt for a minute there are people working for the company that would do something to interfere with a website they don’t like. I shouldn’t have made it sound like the entire company, that was an error on my part. But HEY, Excuse me for making that accusation without it first saying at the bottom of the screen “this serves as prima facie evidence of the fact in any court”.

    What is the definition of “Conspiracy Theorists” in the Liberal world anyways? Everything that a conservative questions? Frankly I believe it is no different than name calling, because that is exactly what it is. Its like political slang instead of using four letter words or the “f” word. And I don’t appreciate it anymore than that either. The worst I said of you is your on the Obama Wagon and would defend anything about him, which some would take as a compliment but I was accused of attacking you. Yet each chance you get you slip in that C.T. when commenting on my ideas. That’s fine, it’s your blog.

  16. Kevin says:

    From the WikiPedia:

    A conspiracy theory is a hypothesis that alleges a coordinated group is, or was, secretly working to commit illegal or wrongful actions, including attempting to hide the existence of the group and its activities. In notable cases the hypothesis contradicts what was, or is, represented as the mainstream explanation for historical or current events. The phrase “conspiracy theory” is also sometimes used dismissively in an attempt to portray hypothetical speculation as being untrue or outlandish.

    I use the word in the first sense (and think of the word sometimes in the second).

    The things I listed are assertions being made today around the web and my comment was intended to alert you that you’re using CT language by explaining Google search results in terms of a Google conspiracy.

    Another forum participant elsewhere wrote this:

    The reason why [Kevin] and others like myself have identified [Obama Citizenship Denial] as a [Conspiracy Theory] is that, when pressed, people who still forward this belief exhibit all the signs of classic CT – repeating debunked evidence, denying sound evidence that disproves their position, and the hallmark: alleging a giant conspiracy to “cover up” the “truth”, yet failing to give a reasonable explanation why so many people from all walks of life – who must be involved for the conspiracy to occur – would do such a thing (i.e. to what end would the HI Sec’y of State blatantly lie to cover this up? To what end would the federal courts “illegally” dismiss lawsuit after lawsuit?)

    As they say, if the shoe fits…

  17. Kevin says:

    December 9, site still up. Looks like a lie to me. Actually, this may really be a fund raising scam.

    Your tax-deductible gifts are alone what fund our non-partisan, not-for-profit national
    programs of civic education, legal advocacy and grassroots constitutional activism.

    Non-partisan my xxx.

  18. Truth says:

    Great Cut/Pastes.

    NEWS FLASH: I’m NOT the Webmaster for your favorite target Wethepeoplefoundation.org, but if it gives you enjoyment to repeat their status have at it. I did the right thing and informed them of their error. You being this great information seeker, claimed you couldn’t find their email, when CONTACT US is on the Main page. I don’t think you really wanted to find it, for them leaving it up gives you more conviction. I don’t support a lie, but I do believe in their goal of ensuring our Constitution is abided by. Amazing the S.C. did such a pathetic job of not hearing the case, but dismissing it with no reason. I would respect them hearing and then dismissing it, but not how they did it.

    [Todays News]
    CHICAGO – Illinois Gov. Rod Blagojevich was arrested on Tuesday on charges that he brazenly conspired to sell or trade the U.S. Senate seat left vacant by President-elect Barack Obama to the highest bidder. . . . . . . . .

    GEE, here we have a Dirty Politician, SAY it isn’t SO!! Democrats don’t do bad things, they don’t try to sell a seat for personnel gain, or God forbid have a document altered for personnel gain, NO WAY!! Those things just don’t happen in the world of “birth certificate professionalism”, at least not that we know about.

    Would we have to say that the FBI were Conspiracy Theorists because they suspected ole Rod “secretly working to commit illegal or wrongful actions”? C.T. is just a term for “Wahhhh, quit trying to find out bad stuff on us, because I’m afraid of what you WILL Find”. Other words, why would people be afraid of the Truth?

  19. Truth says:

    I just went one step farther. In that same difficult to find CONTACT US link on their Main Webpage was also listed their Phone Number. I called it, got their answering machine, and left a message asking they call me back that I had some important information, a sneaky kind of nudge to improve my odds of getting a call. But if not, I’ll keep calling. Feel Free to jump onboard and get that lie removed, or just let it ride.

  20. Kevin says:

    I have a problem finding things in a cluttered environment. If I’m looking for something in a drawer on on the top of a desk, I search three times before saying it’s not there. I only looked on their home page twice. The third time, just now, I found it. I’ll email them now.

  21. Kevin says:

    I just sent this:

    To: info@GiveMeLiberty.org

    There’s an error on your homepage. The image of block 7c from a 1963 birth certificate is the block for the mother’s residence, not where the baby was born. That’s in block 6a, and doesn’t say anything about “foreign”. I’m sure you’ll want to fix this immediately given the importance of the issues involved. You wouldn’t want to hurt your credibility at this time of crisis.


    Kevin

    That’s the best social engineering I know how to do.

  22. Kevin says:

    Truth, I appreciate your efforts to get one false item removed from an anti-Obama web site.

  23. Kevin says:

    So here are the options for WeThePeopleFoundation dot org

    • Whoever did their home page is incomptent
    • Whoever did their home page is indifferent to the accuracy of the page
    • Whoever did their home page engaged in fraud for political reasons
    • Whoever did their home page engaged in fraud for financial reasons
    • Whoever did their home page engaged in fraud for other reasons
  24. Kevin says:

    Truth said: “GEE, here we have a Dirty Politician, SAY it isn’t SO!! Democrats don’t do bad things, they don’t try to sell a seat for personnel gain, or God forbid have a document altered for personnel gain, NO WAY!! Those things just don’t happen in the world of “birth certificate professionalism”, at least not that we know about.”

    I think the lesson to be learned here is not that there are dirty politicians. We all knew that. The lesson to be learned is that there are mechanisms within our political system to deal with dirty politicians. It’s not the job of bloggers to bug the governor’s office (or examine birth certificates).

    If someone thinks Obama is using a forged birth certificate, why don’t they just call the police? I see all these web sites yelling “FRAUD!” and all these lawsuits. Why are we seeing no police reports? Makes you go “hmmmmmm”.

  25. TRUTH says:

    Are you absolutely SERIOUS?!?! the POLICE?!! lmao.

    OH yeah, I called your favorite Website today. First time I left a message, no response by the time I got off work so I called from my cell in the car and they answer…. “hell WTPF, Bob Schulz can I help you.” I thought that was kinda kewl. He recalled receiving my email and at first didn’t even exactly understand what I was talking about, but was receptive and was pulling their website up as we talked.

    Once he got the site up he seen what I was talking about I could hear the embarrassment in his voice, and said he would have it fixed right away.
    I didn’t question Mr. Schulz, but there isn’t just 1 person working there, and it was obvious by his words he was unsure what exactly was even on their front page. I don’t know who “THE MAN” is there, and I don’t care. But I bet they look closer from now on before they post another error.

    http://www.wethepeoplefoundation.org/default.htm

    Whoever did their home page probably got in trouble today or doesn’t have a job anymore.

  26. TRUTH says:

    OOOPSSS… that was supposed to say “hello… “. and not hell. hahaha.. darn keyboard

  27. Kevin says:

    Well Truth, you did a good deed today. You got false information off the web. And I suppose I will have to change my article a little and confess to breaking the commandment about bearing false witness. [Sigh]

    Looking further at http://www.wethepeoplefoundation.org/obama/

    We see some misleading stuff under the title: “HAWAII OFFICIALS REFUSE TO CONFIRM OBAMA HAWAII BIRTH”. The text that follows quotes Janice Okubo in the Chicago Tribune ( their link to article doesn’t work, but THIS ONE: Obama Birth Rumor Debunked does) as saying that she, was not permitted to confirm the authenticity of the certificate released by the Obama campaign.” And that’s true, but they conveniently omit that the same person said that to the Washington Bureau of the same newspaper the Director of Health was saying that Obama was born in Hawaii.

    They say: “Mr. Obama has only proffered a discredited 2007 computer-generated, unsigned” failing to note that in the very Chicago tribune story cited above, the Hawaiian spokesperson says of Obama’s certificate “It looks exactly the same as my own birth certificate,” and of course that the certificate is signed.

    Then they say: “an audio recording of Obama’s grandmother stating she attended Obama’s birth in KENYA.) ” which is true, but in context the “Obama” she was talking about was Barack Obama Sr., her stepson, not Barack Obama II, her grandson. The transcript link is there for you to read.

    Then they go on to say that FactCheck.org made a patently false statement about what Hawaii officials said, citing the argument at the top of the page, which we see is not true.

    So, Mr. Truth, do you want to help them clean up the rest of their errors about Obama? Oh, but if they cleaned it up, there wouldn’t be anything left but that old Indonesian school record which has no bearing on Obama’s citizenship anyway. I guess they should just delete the whole page and go back to their real forte, fighting the Income Tax.

  28. TRUTH says:

    I cleared up a big error, and THE ONLY error you whined about for almost a week. YOu know what, this NEW stuff you bring to light, let me tell you what that is like. I recall clearly SOMEONE saying “Oh, this Birth Certificate issue is just one thing. After it they will complain about something else, then something else…”.

    HEY POT, I Hear the KETTLE CALLING!!!

  29. Kevin says:

    Truth said: “Are you absolutely SERIOUS?!?! the POLICE?!! lmao. ”

    Think about it: police can investigate things, question people, bring charges, get search warrants. Prosecutors can subpoena evidence.

    All these lawsuits are (so far) going exactly nowhere.

    So are you laughing because all the “fraud” and “federal crime” comments on anti-Obama web sites are laughable?

    The only drawback to filing a police report is that there are consequences to filing a false police report, whereas there doesn’t seem to be any for filing a frivolous lawsuit.

  30. Kevin says:

    Truth said: “I cleared up a big error, and THE ONLY error you whined about for almost a week [actually 3 days]. YOu know what, this NEW stuff you bring to light, let me tell you what that is like. I recall clearly SOMEONE saying “Oh, this Birth Certificate issue is just one thing. After it they will complain about something else, then something else…”.”

    You will see these factual errors mentioned in material already posted on this site in one form or another. For example, the Obama grandmother tape is here http://www.blogordie.com/2008/11/the-smoking-grandmother/ and Indonesian Citizenship here: http://www.blogordie.com/2008/12/obama-citizenship-denial-final-summary/ . I just summarized them for you.

  31. LadyFyre says:

    If you can’t see the block where it says, Foreign Country, you HAVE to be BLIND!!!

    • Kevin says:

      And of you can’t see that the blocks in Row 7 pertain to the mother’s usual residence and not the place of birth, then you are blind.

  32. Usah I. says:

    I loved reading this and I dont really like to read 🙂

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